singularityooc | Policy Discussion

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Policy Discussion

Some of Singularity's players have questions about the game policies on AU character applications. This post has been put up to allow players to approach the staff to ask questions, offer suggestions, and voice concerns regarding those policies. The moderators are also available via IM/PM [contact information] if any player does not feel comfortable discussing their concerns in public.

As of the end of this application round (August 15th), AU applications will be closed until this matter can be resolved. This ban on AU apps does not apply to the exceptions listed in the AU policies (malleable protagonists and canon AUs).

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Basically seconding what Jack-mun said. That sort of AU would be fair to reject because, although interesting in concept, Aang becoming a bitter, angry avenger wouldn't be very good characterization, seeing as how that would go against all of his lifelong beliefs.

But, for example, if he came out of that Fire Nation torture severely shaken, more somber, with a better understanding of his enemy, what they're capable of, and what they're willing to do, that would be more understandable given his character.

So while seemingly bad ideas could be pulled off well by someone who really examines the character, good ideas could seem like really bad ones based on how the particular person implements the changes. Aang as a bitter, angry avenger in this AU would fall into the latter.

It would work as an AU - I'm not debating that. I'm saying it would be unfair to expect his castmates to have to deal with an Aang who wanted to talk about his torture at the hands of the Fire Nation, which is why it might not be appropriate for a panfandom game. it would be an AU idea better explored in a fanfic/musebox/etc.

Hmmm, I don't think that's really of concern to the app process and how apps are handled, though. A:TLA characters may not want to deal with the awkwardness of having such an AU!Aang, but they also may not want to deal with Azula--does that mean Azula should not be allowed to be applied for either? If anything, these issues are ones that should be worked out ICly, I think.

Restricting AU apps because it might make current characters feel uncomfortable doesn't seem fair to the applicant, since situations in which characters feel uncomfortable can be created with OU characters and canonmates as well. The AU applicants have as much right to play their characters out as anyone else.

Couldn't have put it as well myself.

I play Sokka in another game, and frankly, playing against bitter!avenger!Aang is something that would make me unhappy and uncomfortable as a player in addition to making my character uncomfortable. I am then faced with two choices: avoid and ignore the AU Aang, which would be out of character, or force myself to play with this character I don't care for.

It's not just about the characters; it's about the players, too.

I think that's similarly up to the players to work out and reach a compromise. You and the AU-mun can agree to disagree and not have your characters interact, and if so, rarely--concessions for this sort of thing can be made. But I don't think it should be a deciding factor in whether or not the AU app is accepted or not.

The apps are there to filter out the characters who are being played well from the characters who aren't. If the AU character is being played well, then they should be allowed into the game. From there, it's up to the players to work out these issues.

Alternatively: I only just remembered this, but I've been in some AU-friendly games where mods will check in with canonmates of the AU character in question to weigh in on their opinions on the app. Obviously, the mods have final say, but asking for feedback from current canonmates, if there are any, can help weed the good from the bad as well.

It can be OOC simply for canonmates to not interact, though. For example, if an AU version of John Connor apped, no matter what the change was, it would be very OOC for Sarah Connor to ignore him - whether I as her player was comfortable with the AU or not. Avoiding interaction between canonmates can work in some instances, in the same way that someone can app two canonmates and have them never interact. But if the characters are related or otherwise have close relationships in canon, simply avoiding each other in game sometimes really isn't an option.

I disagree that the comfort of existing players shouldn't be a factor - even, in some cases, a deciding one - in which AUs are accepted. There is a precedent for player comfort being taken into account when looking at dark or controversial apps in Sing, and while I don't think apps should be policed, per say, or that canonmates should always have veto power over what new apps are accepted, I'm also kind of uncomfortable with the idea that any AU should be accepted as long as it's well written enough. I don't think there's anything wrong with the comfort of the existing playerbase, and the feasibility of character interactions once in the game, being considered when looking at apps.

...I'm also not sure why anyone would want to app an AU that made canonmates so uncomfortable/were so radically different than what they could cope with that the muns had to agree to avoid interaction IC. I don't really see the point of apping into a cast that you can't play with.

I disagree; apps aren't there simply to make sure the writing is up to scratch. It's also to make sure that the character will be a good fit with the rest of the game.

Personally, I don't see what's wrong with consulting a cast before dealing an acceptance to an AU app that could cause problems. If the current cast has an issue with it, I think it's fair to disallow the AU since it's difficult for canon castmates to avoid AU castmates most of the time.

Comfort of existing players is important, but it's better to, well... ask, rather than assume. Maybe the castmates really like an AU, maybe some of them don't, just assuming one way or the other is a little unfair for everyone. In a case where there is no existing cast, as long as the AU is played well I don't see why canon characters that don't exist in the game yet and might never exist should be put above AU applicants.

Sorry for kinda throwing this in the middle here (hi nathan mun hi), but. I guess I'm getting the impression from a lot of people that they are uncomfortable with AUs that are not slight deviations from a canon? I don't know, I can't really argue with that since it's only an opinion, but if Singularity is supposed to be a game that accepts AUs I think its a bit on the silly side to hold such a strictly-canon mindset in general. I haven't played in too many AU games myself, but I've had the impression that a lot of communication between casts is involved just to avoid problems like AU characters that canon castmates don't want. If someone is just against the idea of an AU character they might not be able to treat like a canon one, I'm not sure why they would choose to app at a game that accepts AUs in the first place. It's supposed to be one of the reasons people come to games like sing.

I'm really repeating myself now, but just because more drastic changes in AUs might be allowed doesn't mean ones that are difficult to interact with should be accepted. I just think this is something that would be better and more fairly dealt with on an individual basis. If something can cause problems, that doesn't mean it will every time, and that doesn't make it fair to reject entire categories of AUs just because not all of them will work. These are specific problems that can be easily addressed without resorting to "you changed too much."

The difference here is that avoiding a canon character your character dislikes is IC. Wanting nothing to do with Azula is totally IC for, say, Toph. It's not IC for her to avoid Aang - any Aang.

Again, I'm not saying AU people don't have a right to play out their AUs. I have two AU characters myself. The problem is when it becomes so radically different from canon that it affects other players, because canon versions of characters shouldn't feel uncomfortable playing their versions of characters either.

I think this in particular comes back to a tonal shift. At the end of the day, no matter how you swing it, A:TLA is a children's show. That means the characters don't go around saying 'fuck' or 'damn' or 'shit', they don't get hideously tortured and at the end of the day, they win the good fight. They have their quandaries and their hardships, but even though A:TLA is a fairly mature show overall, that deals with mature themes, it's still at its core meant for children. I think conserving tone is every bit as important as conserving characterization in an AU.

For example. Suddenly, in Canterlot, aliens attack! And all the ponies have spent the last five years fighting in a brutal alien war! Rainbow Dash suddenly has an eyepatch, and maybe Fluttershy is missing a limb and etc et al - of course this is a fairly extreme example (and as you mentioned, the characterization would be what suffers there) but the tone is so drastically different that even if you did manage to write ALIENS ATTACKING CANTERLOT in the world's most IC, compelling way possible, the change in tone would still have the potential to make people uncomfortable, because they come expecting ADORABLE FRIENDSHIP PONY POWERS and they get greeted with Fluttershy having a bionic gun-leg or something.

Essentially, because RP is a collaborative writing effort, it's not always necessarily about what one player wants to do. Because while playing grimdark, somber Aang might be extremely fun for the mun - and maybe even for a few other people who like exploring those options, I know I certainly wouldn't want to have to interact with an Aang like that if I were playing a castmate. As someone who's played Zuko (a million years ago and very briefly), I can safely say that it would probably break my characterization of Zuko to be around that sort of Aang. That doesn't mean the other person is a bad writer, or that I myself am, it just means that I'm adhering to the characterization of a tonally different source material. Suddenly, I have to pick two options. Play Zuko as someone who's seen this sort of thing occur in the past and chosen to ignore it (and I'm talking serious heavy duty torture, not at all equivalent to Zuko being burned by his father or Aang being lightning-fuu'd by Azula), or picking to play Zuko who knows that that sort of thing doesn't happen in his world by dint of it being a world for the imaginations of children to run riot in, which means automatically that he has to react to this Aang as if he's an intruder, an imposter or simply someone entirely outside of his world or scope of experience.

TL:DR, some AUs make it hard for people to write around them based on tonal shift and source material!

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